ENL thus far and future picking strategy

1st Half

So we're nearly half way through and are likely to finish this half of the cycle 5th, one spot outside a playoff place. Important to note here that if we hadn't messed up our roster in the first match we would be first. However we did and as such we are not first. All in all guys we've done well. If you look at our match results you will see a stunning upwards trend from crushing defeats to repeated victories.



2nd Half

To some extent we can only ask for more of the same, we've beaten nearly every opponent put in front of us and we're currently undefeated. However that's not to say there isn't room for improvement. The addition of the the old Sarrdak guys will see us strengthened a lot, there's a lot more competition for first team spots now. It's not like we now have any one player who is too good not to be played, we have strength and depth now. So we're all gonna have to keep getting better if we want to keep up with the way the clan is going. I think we're at a pretty good point. We've become more competitive but we have not lost our community spirit. It's what makes this clan great and we shouldn't forget that.

So what about our picking strategy for the next half? Well I think it's about time we started going for those around us. If we look at who's likely to get promoted we can develop our strategy from there. Let's assume for the sake of my argument that RS will finish first. Inquisition will likely finish 2nd:

1. Runaway Scorpions
2. Inquisition
3.
4.

This leaves two playoff spots. So let's look at who's likely to be contending for these spots:

Foolocracy of Fedner: I find these guys difficult to pin down. Good certainly but great? probably not. Let's face it they hardly gave ARMY a pounding in their first match, the got smacked down by Inquisition and they barely scraped past RE. I really think we can beat them. As long as we're firing on all cylinders, we out-skill them.
Red Eagle: Decent but beatable, don't know too much.
Warsong Clan: Those of you who played in the match know these guys are beatable. They're good yes but we should have beaten them.
Deutschritter: Watch out for these guys. I know a few of you think they're not much cop but they will be there abouts by the end of the cycle.

So that's 5 teams who can realistically compete for the two places. I'm pretty sure we will be able to get promoted, we just need to be playing well and as a team. So in summary, let's keep getting better and keep winning.

Deacon Barry

You realise we are disadvantaged because of the 2 penalty points, we are curently on 10 but on paper we are only on 8. Therefore, anyone who is 4 or 5 points outside the top 4 stand a chance of getting those spaces.

I'm not disagreeing with you at the fact we should go for teams higher than us. But what we gather from other clans is rather limited, even though we go by the assumption (such as RS) that they are a good clan. Anything could happen.

As soon as we start to think we are going to beat other clans, it runs the risk of building up unnecessary hype and over confidence. Unless we are certain we wil beat them, I would prefer if we took the "one game at a time" method for a few matches, maybe once we've played 8, before we consider blazing all guns on who ever suits the top of our priorities.

Against Gothic, I wasn't there but days before the match, we assumed they weren't so good. The result was quite a suprise to us all, because we expected to hammer them. It's difficult to win rounds when you start losing against a team you would expect to beat.

For this reason I personally wouldn't look at opponents to beat, just yet. We should be getting our selves in a strong a position as possible by racking up the points and rounds against the teams that we are certain to hammer, before aiming for those around us.

I think that given the way the selection system works for fights we're likely to have little choice in who we are fighting. It's likely in my opinion that we'll be mostly having to fight the clans who are in the middle of the pack just below us. At this point they will be getting more desperate for positions (after another round or two this should be pretty certain) so will want to try and attack those ahead of them the same way we do.

As long as we're near the top like this we will have no say in the matter so I think we will mostly have to play it as we see it and make the best choices we can at the time of selection.

So in some ways I agree with stubs, we need to play it on a week by week basis but at the same time I also think that when we do have the choice the only selections will be the clans deacon is proposing to fight. So I think we will have to follow that route anyway.

Gothic was actually much improved from the last match. But at the same time, I feel that over-confidence is indeed what screwed us up and could have cost us the match. But avoiding over-confidence is just a matter of having people around to bring you back down to earth. And I doubt we'd go into a match against a higher tier opponent with such a mindset. I'm just not sure how much stronger we could realistically go in. I mean, if we aren't strong enough to at least take on the higher tier clans, then we won't be before the cycle is up. And since we managed to fight Warsong Clan to a standstill after screwing up early on, I think we're capable of doing it, though not guaranteed.

Keep in mind there's a difference between honest tactical assessment like me and Deacon are doing and thinking we're "da bomb." A big difference. I'd say do some scouting of our potential rivals and work from there. But I think sitting on our hands and avoiding real competition for another couple of weeks won't do too much.

How the hell is ARMY 6th o_O

Quote :

You realise we are disadvantaged because of the 2 penalty points, we are curently on 10 but on paper we are only on 8. Therefore, anyone who is 4 or 5 points outside the top 4 stand a chance of getting those spaces.

I was of the belief that the penalty point system does not effect your point tally in the slightest. It's simply a way of him keeping track of how many infringements teams have incurred. When a team reaches 6 they are kicked out of the league.

Quote :

As soon as we start to think we are going to beat other clans, it runs the risk of building up unnecessary hype and over confidence. Unless we are certain we wil beat them, I would prefer if we took the "one game at a time" method for a few matches, maybe once we've played 8, before we consider blazing all guns on who ever suits the top of our priorities.

By then it could already be too late. The way the picking is done means we may not get many opportunities to pick an opponent above ourselves, as such we need to take them when we can. We're half way through already, we need to gun for them now.

Quote :

Against Gothic, I wasn't there but days before the match, we assumed they weren't so good. The result was quite a suprise to us all, because we expected to hammer them. It's difficult to win rounds when you start losing against a team you would expect to beat.

For this reason I personally wouldn't look at opponents to beat, just yet. We should be getting our selves in a strong a position as possible by racking up the points and rounds against the teams that we are certain to hammer, before aiming for those around us.

But that's just unrealistic. There is no way we will be able to play teams we are "certain to hammer". If given the opportunity to pick we must pick people who pose a threat to us not simply the worst team there. At some point we'll have to fight the big clans. If we wait too long the opportunity might never arise.

Nomsterify wrote:

How the hell is ARMY 6th o_O

They got two matches which gave them 20:0 wins because of roster violations, one was us.

It's easy to come comfortable with the enemy you know deacon. I'm not saying don't challenge the top, I'm saying we should focus on securing a position as easily and as quickly as possible...

It is hard to predict who will pick us. You seem to think that we should target teams above us, but we are infact more likely to be picked by anyone...

What ever really, let's not get ahead of our selves by thinking we can "beat anyone"...

Resolution to all this problems! Win all the match's! Training hard, commitment, focus and team work will allow us to do that.

Stuboi wrote:

What ever really, let's not get ahead of our selves by thinking we can "beat anyone"...

No one said this.. not ever.

We can't get picked by everyone because most won't want to pick us. At most there is about 7 teams we're likely to fight. I'm simply saying when we CAN pick that we should pick those placed 3rd and 4th.

Pff, it's been said numerous times after the warsong match, applying to those in our division obviously...

Drawing a line under that, I'm trying to say that when we do get to pick for our selves, it is easy to get carried away and build up too much hype. I'm not disagreeing with you but we can't just say which teams to fight just yet. 2 weeks is enough time for teams to build up and find form, but it is also one where you can lose it.

My point is, it's too early. That's my opinion and I'll hold by it. Regardless whether you are right or wrong about firing all guns as soon as the second half commences.

so you think after we drew with a clan in our division, we claimed we could beat everyone? Sorry stuboi No one has said anything like that and certainly no one has claimed such in this thread.

How can you on the one hand state that we will rarely get the opportunity to pick our opponent and state on the other hand that we should wait longer before striking?

I think Stubs is referring to the attitude we went into the Gothic match with. And I agree, we got really cocky, but it wasn't because we managed to come back and fight Warsong to a standstill. It's because we had beaten Gothic before and assumed that nothing had changed (or at least some of us did, I know I didn't, though I wasn't vocal about the cockiness I was seeing). It had nothing to do with previous ENL matches, though. We're definitely doing well, but WSC proved we aren't great.

Listen, no one's getting carried away Stubs, least of all me, and I still agree with Deacon. I can see your argument about being cautious and I have yet to hear anyone argue against caution, but we're halfway through; we have to start hitting challenges. In our draw against WSC, do I see us as invincible? No. Only a friggen' moron would. We clearly have our deficiencies, as the last two matches demonstrated. But at the same time, the fact that we could come back in the WSC match means something. We are capable, not guaranteed, of beating teams above us. But we need to remain sharp and focused to do that. We can't be ruled by arrogance, but we also shouldn't allow mistakes to hold us back and cloud our judgement. If anything, as Maynd said, we ought to focus on improving ourselves so mistakes don't happen again.

Killfacer wrote:

so you think after we drew with a clan in our division, we claimed we could beat everyone? Sorry stuboi No one has said anything like that and certainly no one has claimed such in this thread.

How can you on the one hand state that we will rarely get the opportunity to pick our opponent and state on the other hand that we should wait longer before striking?

You did, it goes something like this; "I reckon that now we were able to face up to warsong and get a good result against them, maybe a match we should have won. That there's no one in the league that we aren't capable of facing and get a result against them (Except maybe RS and Inquisition)." It was along those lines.

Actually, I stated that there is a very unlikely chance that we will get to pick for our selves and that we would stand more of a chance of being picked.

I do mention that we just wait until what happens when the ENL kicks off again. For christ sake we've only just finished this half and anything could happen between now and then. I'm pointing out the fact that we should wait for maybe the 1st two results when we get back to see how teams have changed (if they changed) and then consider whether or not we should face them.

I never stated that people are getting carried away, what I said never implied that people are. I believe in just being cautious. Again, we don't know what will happen in future and if we target clans now on who to face, theres a high chance that our assumptions are incorrect and just like against Gothic, the whole positive attitude back fires. Hence why I say we must take it "one game at a time".

I'm stating teams change. The transfer deadline is the 27th December. Who knows...?

Here`s whats gonna happen guys.
We`re gonna wait. We`re gonna enjoy these 3 weeks of no ENL matches.
We`re gonna be refreshed in week 8. We`re gonna play our best,and we`re gonna hopefully win a few matches.

As it stands,we`ve gotten 1 pick (unless im wrong,maybe 2) in 5 weeks. What we want,doesnt matter. Judging from the result of our last match,we probably wont get a pick next time either. And thats fine! Sure being able to pick our enemies would make it better,but meh,fuck it. We`ll just play. As it stands,I`d rather meet RS than Army,because we would probably put up a better fight vs a good clan than a clan we can obviously beat. Never underestimate your opponent guys.

This thread should basically be looked at as a hypothetical situation thing,or "in a perfect world,heres what we do."
Which is fine,but dont look that much into it untill the pickings actually happen. A long term analysis in Div C is probably just a waste of time.

I know that im in no position to give advises,given the few days im with the clan now, and i dont want to do that.
BUT i want to post my opinon.
I think its better to force the enemy to react to your tactics than the other way around, i also think that gothic couldnt be taken as an example how you would play normally ,i myself failed baaad at some points but it was good something like that happened now and not later count it as a warning.

The most important thing for EVERY clan is to look at the strong points they have and which weakness has to be improved.
A unique tactic is always best even if it is more offensive or defensive cause it gets the enemy confused and he starts reacting to your behavior so you can easily trick him lure him into death traps.
Given 3 weeks we have time make some plans and to collect some new ideas.
How about a special training day after christmas and new year for those who have the time?

Just don get lazy,get HUNGRY guys *howls* !

Just to add my 2 cents.

CHEERS

When you put it that way, yeah I would agree, why wait for an action for us to react to.

How ever, you could debate that point on "where to start", since no action from other clans has actually been prepared or shown.

Its a catch 22 phrase, 'Damned if we do and damned if we don't.'

I personally think we all need a rest. Leave it til after Christmas and come back to it before the new year, ready to play after the new year. XD